Author Topic: NEW UPDATES  (Read 25 times)


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« on: September 15, 2019, 08:53:40 am »

1. Goals
2. Letters
3. Falls of Blood from Venus
4. On the Orientation of Ancient Temples and Other Anomalies
5. When Was the Lunar Surface Last Molten?
6. Venus Before Exodus
7. Comets and the Bronze Age Collapse

1. Goals: 1. Popularize optimum scientific method & scholarship (See TB Forum).
a. Improve Mike Fischer's model.
b. Add 2 articles (Ancient Maps & Scientific Evidence) that support a date of just over 4k years ago for the Great Flood & Meteor Bombardment (See TB Forum) to correct Mike Fischer's date.
c. Add JB's article on Noah's Flood to prove that the Flood caused the geological column (seen in 24 or more basins) of 6 megasequences caused by an orbiting body, like the Moon, on a briefly elliptical orbit.
d. Add Creation article evidence that basins were formed by impacts before the Flood.
e. Add that the breakup of the Saturn system produced the meteors and dust that produced impacts and destroyed much of the biosphere (See Saturn Theory).
f. Add that the Moon and Mars were impacted at about the same time as Earth (Saturn Theory).
g. Add that the impacts caused electrical effects, including radioactivity, on Earth (See WB, TB and CC's Astrophysics).

Scientific Evidence for A Major World Catastrophe About 11,500 Years Ago: A Preliminary Selection [SIS C&C Review]


1.vein: lead (+fossil) --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Derbyshire, UK
2.cave: iron-oxide (+fossil) --- - --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Gailenreuth, Germany
3.breccia: iron-ore (+fossil) ---  --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Kesslerloch, Switzerland
4.rock-fissures: iron-ore (+fossil) (up to 720 ft deep) -- --- --- --- --- --- --- Carniola, Austria
5.caves: ore cement (+fossil) ---  --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Wellington Valley, Australia
6.cave breccia: iron stain (+fossil) --- - --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Tea Tree Cave, Queensland, Australia
7.drift sand & gravel: metal (+fossil) --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Turnham Green +Acton, Middlesex, UK (1800s)
8.iron-sand: iron patina/stain (+fossil) --- - --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Vilyui, Siberia, Russia
9.glacial deposits: iron-oxide stain (+artifact) --- - --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Nampa, Idaho, (late 1800s)
10.drift stones and sand grains: iron oxide stain ---  --- --- --- --- --- --- --- South Yorkshire +Wiltshire +Humberside, UK (=<15 ft thick)
11.drift gravels: manganous stain --- ---- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Radley, UK +other places around Abingdon, UK (formation of 'brief duration')
12.drift deposits: iron-oxide stain +gold +platinum +diamonds ---- --- --- --- --- France +Germany +Poland +western Russia +other European +near-eastern countries
13.drift: iron-oxide stain +manganese +copper +asphalt +oil --- -- --- --- --- --- Israel +Jordan
14.drift: gold flakes +platinum +lead +zinc +iron ore ---- --- --- --- --- --- --- Indiana +Michigan +Minnesota +Virginia +the Carolinas (sometimes at great depths occupying the uneven surfaces of the underlying bedrock)
15.drift: nickel +nearly pure copper pieces +metals --- -- --- --- --- --- --- --- Sudbury, Ontario
16.irony-clay deposits: copper pieces (one 3,000 lb) +good quality diamonds -- --- Ontario to Ohio
17.drift: diamonds (in silicate rocks associated with volcanism) --- - --- --- --- southern margins of Hudson Bay (where no recent volcanic activity has occurred)
18.loess: manganese nodules (Pisolites) --- --- --- -- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- Northern China
19.loess: metal nodules --- -- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- other regions, China
20.loess: silica +heavy minerals +up to 20.26% aluminium +up to 7.80% iron --- --- Nebraska
21.drift gravel: manganese +cobalt +iron +lead +zinc +copper --- - --- --- --- --- mouth of Fraser River, British Columbia
22.fossil beds: immense banks +lenses of frozen volcanic dust +ejecta: fossil ---- Siberia +Alaska fossil beds
23.sea bed clays +muds: much oxidised ferric iron particles --- -- --- --- --- --- the Arctic
24.sea bed clays +muds: much manganese oxide - --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- White Sea +Barents Sea, Siberian coast
25.floor sediments: volcanic ash +much nickel +radium (both rare in sea water) --- Pacific Ocean
26.patchy young radioactive clays in much of the ocean floor:
much radioactive ferromanganese nodules +cobalt +nickel +copper +other heavy ores --- oceans
_Oceanographers concluded that the nickel and iron in sea floor deposits were of meteoric origin


Re: Evidence of Ancient Global Cataclysm
by Lloyd Mon Sep 02, 2019 7:45 pm
The Major Cataclysms Occurred Less Than 5,000 Years Ago

An article by C. Ginenthal about Ancient Maps shows that Antarctica was apparently largely ice-free 6,000 years ago, based on drill cores at the Ross ice shelf and probably other measurements. If it's true that it was ice-free at that time, I think this means the Shock Dynamics impact and rapid continental drift occurred shortly before that, like within years, because the Arctic lands and Antarctica moved toward the frigid poles due to the impact, and the ice sheets built up soon after. An ancient map also shows Greenland without its ice sheet.

The article is at:

_Here's the quoted portion:
"Not only do these cartographers say the map is accurate, but they point out that, during the 1957 to 1958 Geophysical Year, other teams of seismic scientists, like that of Paul Emile Victor, went into Antarctica and made soundings of the topography under the ice, and that these soundings confirmed the accuracy of the Oronteus Fineus map. Therefore, we have the Piri Re'is map of Antarctica confirmed as accurate by the U.S. Navy Hydrographic Office and the Norwegian-British-Swedish Expedition of 1949, and the Oronteus Fineus map of Antarctica confirmed as accurate by Strategic Air Command's map office and the International Geophysical Year teams of 1957 to 1958. These findings are further corroborated by other evidence. According to Hapgood: During the Byrd Expedition of 1947-1948, Dr. Jack Hough, then of the University of Illinois, took three cores from the bottom of the ocean off the Ross Sea, and these were dated by the ionium method of radioactive dating, of the Carnegie Institution in Washington, by Dr. W. D. Urry, ... one of those to develop this method. The cores showed alternations of types of sediments.... There was a coarse glacial sediment, as was to be expected, and fine sediments of semiglacial type, but there were also layers of finer sediments typical of temperate climates. [These were the sort ...] carried down by rivers from ice-free continents. Here was the first surprise, then. Temperate conditions had evidently prevailed in Antarctica in the not distant past. The sediment[s indicated that, no fewer than three times during the Pleistocene Epoch, a temperate climate had prevailed in the Ross Sea. Then, when this material was dated by Urry, it was revealed that the most recent temperate period had been very recent indeed. In fact, it ended only about 6,000 years ago. Hough wrote: "The log of core N-5 shows glacial marine sediment from the present to 6,000 years ago. From 6,000 to 15,000 years ago, the sediment is fine-grained, with the exception of one granule at about 12,000 years ago. This suggests an absence of ice from the area during that period, except for a stray iceberg 12,000 years ago." (19) This evidence is further corroborated by Reginald Daly, who informs us that "[carbon-14] dating has shown that Antarctica's ice is less than 6,000 years old. (Emphasis added.) [Arthur Holmes writes: `Algal remains dated at 6,000 BP [Before Present] have been found on the latest terminal moraines.'" (20) Thus, in addition to the accuracy of the Piri Re'is map and the Oronteus Fineus map of Antarctica, we have measurements from cores in the Ross Sea and from the last glacial deposits containing a temperate species of algae that also show that Antarctica was not covered by ice 6,000 years ago. The evidence indicates that the Piri Re'is and Oronteus Fineus maps of Antarctica, published in the 16th century, are accurate and authentic representations of the continent as has been confirmed by scientists in the fields of seismic soundings and cartography. This shows that Antarctica was largely ice-free 6,000 years ago and is corroborated by evidence of cores from the Ross Sea and by the dating of algae in terminal moraines. The only way that such accurate maps could have been made prior to the 16th century is if Antarctica was not buried under thousands of feet of ice, when its climate had to be tremendously different."
_End of quote.
(Note: I assume that the object found at "12,000" years ago was not from an iceberg and the sediment dated older than 6,000BP was not older than that. See below.)

Mike Fischer of proposed that the Shock Dynamics impact event (in which an asteroid from 33 to 78 miles in diameter struck the former supercontinent, Pangaea, north of Madagascar, and caused the continents to split off rapidly to their present locations) occurred shortly before the time of the Younger Dryas impact maybe 11,000 years ago, though he said privately that it could have occurred as recently as 4200 years ago. So if Antarctica was ice-free less than 6,000 years ago, the Shock Dynamics event must have occurred shortly before that. And the Younger Dryas impact must have occurred about the same time, i.e. less than 6,000 years ago.

I've since read Melvyn Cook's article, Earth Tectonics Viewed from Rock Mechanics at:
_Here's the relevant part.
"Dating the Rupture of Pangaea, Continental Drift, and the EGRR [Earth-girdling rift and ridges]
Farrand and Gajda determined, by the equilibrium radiocarbon method [10] that the beginning of the 'uplifts' in Canada occurred 7,500 to 10,500 years ago (8700 +/- 765 years before present: this date is the average value read from the 'isobases' surrounding Hudson Bay, the maxima for these uplifts). To obtain this result they used the equilibrium radiocarbon values of Libby [33] who at first found a value of 0.78 for C14/C.o14 [C14 is the biospheric radiocarbon concentration and C.o14 is the expected value based on the known intensity of galactic cosmic rays. Libby interpreted the difference simply as lost radiocarbon. In 1963, Lingenfelter [34] of the Libby school reduced this value to 0.73 and in 1964 he and Flamm [35] found a still lower value of 0.675. If Farrand and Gajda had used the 1964 result, the maximum equilibrium radiocarbon date for the uplifts in northeastern Canada would have been 7550 +/- 655 years BP. However, this date would have been only 4740 years BP if they had used the 1964 result and interpreted it, not by the equilibrium radiocarbon method, but by the non-equilibrium radiocarbon dating model [36], dictated by the actual observations of 1964 without assuming C14 loss from the atmosphere and oceans. Heiskanen and Vening-Meinesz studied the uplifts in Fennoscandia [11] by the observed gravity anomaly, which they found obeys the same exponential decay law as radioactivity. They found for the uplifts in the Bay of Bothnia ... [that] The beginning of the uplifts was ... about 4300 years before the date of their investigation, or about 4345 BP."
_End of quote.
Note: the uplifts began when the ice caps were removed.

The reason I said above that the sediments below the less than 6,000 year old sediments were not older than that is because the sediments must have mostly all been deposited at about the same time, as I explained in this thread 2 years ago at in a post I titled: Sedimentary Rock Strata Prove Catastrophism.

There I said: "Re: Sedimentary Rock Strata: What brief explanation is there for the fact that sedimentary rock strata covering large continental areas are generally sorted into different rock types, i.e. esp. sandstones, claystones, and limestones? I.e., assuming that millions to billions of years of erosion and deposition occurred, how was it possible for only one rock type to be deposited over large areas for thousands of years, followed by thousands of years of another rock type, etc? The only plausible means I know of for separation of strata into such individual rock types is by major flooding over short time spans, as demonstrated by Guy Berthault. The geologic column is said to consist of 6 megasequences worldwide, each containing many conforming sedimentary strata, and each megasequence occurring over an unconformity. The best explanation seems to be that each megasequence was deposited during major flooding over a short time span of days or weeks. Since the unconformities between the megasequences seem to show mainly only sheet eroision, there must have been only short time spans of days, weeks or months between each megasequence deposit."

Early in this thread I showed evidence that major cataclysms occurred about 4240 years ago, including a Great Flood. The Shock Dynamics event seems to have been the cause of the flood and of rapid continental drift and of mountain building and most fossil formation and extinctions and it now appears that the best evidence is that it occurred less than 5,000 years ago and the Younger Dryas event occurred after that. Only one large asteroid caused the Shock Dynamics Pangaea splitting event etc, but that asteroid was accompanied by numerous other objects, many of which also struck the Earth and the Moon at that time, maybe over a period of centuries. And the Ancient Maps article by Ginenthal above suggests that civilization was highly advanced before the event and for some time after.

Re: Evidence of Ancient Global Cataclysm
by moses Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:55 pm
I am pretty sure now that all those 10,000 BC, or so, datings are in error and should be around 4,000 BC. This is because of Noah's flood event which introduced a large amount of carbon to Earth and changed from a 360 day year to the 365.24 year commemorated in the Great Pyramid.

Thus Gobekli Tepe would then be just before the Sumerian civilisation and things make a lot more sense.
Re: Evidence of Ancient Global Cataclysm
by Lloyd Tue Sep 03, 2019 5:58 pm
Thanks, Mo. Yes, Gobekli Tepi makes more sense at just over 4,000 years ago because of familiar astrological symbols used there, I think, which may refer to a date. As for the Flood event adding C14 to the Earth, can you provide any authoritative references for that? Maybe I'll have time to look for info on that before long myself.

By the way, I think the mythological evidence etc for the Saturn Theory is also something that needs to be incorporated into the ancient global cataclysm model. Maybe it will help us identify the source of the meteor stream/s etc that caused the cataclysms. Maybe the unusual minerals mentioned in one article came from the meteor stream or one of the planets of the polar configuration. I'll check out the relevant article I just read lately real quick.

Maybe this article: "Scientific Evidence for A Major World Catastrophe About 11,500 Years Ago: A Preliminary Selection D S Allan" at:

And this article: "The Flood" at:

Re: Evidence of Ancient Global Cataclysm
by Lloyd Tue Sep 03, 2019 7:20 pm
The first article I listed in the previous post is the one with the info about minerals. Following is a quote.

"The Metal Factor
Especially noteworthy are the numerous instances of 'drift'-age animals and plants found agglutinated by, embedded within, or unexpectedly associated with, certain ores. Examples include a nearly complete rhinoceros skeleton entombed in a vein of lead in Derbyshire [35], thousands of agglutinated bones in a cave at Gailenreuth, Germany [36], many more cemented together in red iron-oxide stained breccia at Kesslerloch, Switzerland [37], those within nearly pure iron-ore infilling rock-fissures descending to 720 ft [220m below ground level in Carniola, Austria [38] and ore-agglutinated masses of bones occupying cave after cave in Australia's Wellington Valley [39]. Many cave breccias are strongly ferruginised. That of Tea Tree Cave in Queensland is an outstanding example [40]. Animals remains from 'drift'-age sands and gravel also often exhibit external metalliferous staining. Typical examples were the mammoth and other mammal bones found at Turnham Green and Acton, Middlesex, last century 'loaded with manganous oxide' [41]. Molluscs possessing a pronounced ferruginous patina occurred in blue-grey iron-sand overlying the celebrated frozen rhinoceros carcass of Vilyui in Siberia [42]. Even a small soapstone idol exhumed from 'glacial' deposits over 280 feet (86m.) below ground level at Nampa, Idaho, late last century was found invested with reddish iron oxide [43]. At many localities the stones and sand grains constituting much of the 'drift' itself have been similarly ferruginised."

Numerous examples of metal or mineral staining or contents in the "drift" is mentioned in addition to the above. The paragraph after that says "loess" also contains such things and appears to have originated at the same time as the drift etc. Drift is defined as: "In geology, drift is the name for all material of glacial origin found anywhere on land or at sea, including sediment and large rocks (glacial erratic). Glacial origin refers to erosion, transportation and deposition by glaciers." Loess is defined as: "Loess, an unstratified, geologically recent deposit of silty or loamy material that is usually buff or yellowish brown in colour and is chiefly deposited by the wind. Loess is a sedimentary deposit composed largely of silt-size grains that are loosely cemented by calcium carbonate."

Charles Ginenthal had another article about so-called glacial deposits actually being flood deposits, often over a fractured ice sheet, if I understood him correctly.

So I hope to come to understand better how the staining etc came about in the drift and loess etc.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2019, 06:44:29 pm by Admin »